[music]
Becky: A warm welcome to Becky & Ben’s Fertility Spotlight.
Ben: This podcast is about our support and your success. We focus on the key topics and the best mindset.
Becky: Today, we’re talking to medical herbalist and reflexologist Jodie Foreman about optimizing our fertility.
Ben: As always, speak to a qualified doctor for the best advice.
Becky: Let’s hear from Jodie and the healing power of hands and herbs.
[music]
Today, we are delighted to have Jodie Foreman in the studio with us. She’s a herbalist and reflexologist with her own practice. We are very interested in talking to Jodie about how herbs and reflexology can optimize fertility.
Ben: I remember, Becky, you didn’t take any herbs, but you did have reflexology. You were very chilled out after it. I remember that.
Becky: Yes, I was. A lovely girl called Chloe, when we lived up north, she was very sweet. She was very young. She was only about 18, I think. I knew her mom. She came to practice on me, on my feet, when I was going through a lot of difficulties. She was very sensitive. She located areas that might be connected to fertility. I remember afterwards, feeling extremely relaxed and lighter, in a sense.
Ben: I remember you were really, really relaxed afterwards, so much so that I said to Chloe, “Can I have a go?” I think it’s just the intimacy of someone else being in the room, knowing their craft, and just getting you to chill out.
Becky: I do know that it can be incredibly effective. What inspired you to become a reflexologist and then a herbalist?
Jodie Foreman: When I was 17, I was poorly. I was doing my A-levels. I kept having these weird, almost like fainting attacks, which I then, later on, found out was a form of epilepsy. I went up to London, had loads of scans and tests and things, saw a neurologist. They put me on lots of medication, which I really struggled to take. In the end, I had been diagnosed with epilepsy, but I came off the medication, went on herbal medicine, had reflexology, found it enormously helpful, and continued on with that for some time. Never did have a full-blown seizure. Never had any problems since. That diagnosis has been taken off my medical notes. I felt like, oh, there’s something in this. This is amazing. I’d always really been interested in people, working with people, thought I would probably go into some sort of caring profession.
Ben: You studied herbal medicine at the University of Westminster. Clearly, it had made an impression on you from an early age. Was that an enjoyable course?
Jodie: It was fantastic. It was the Bachelor of Science, so it was a lot more– I guess it was a lot more sciencey in a way. That sounds a strange thing to say. I thought it was going to be because you study biochemistry, you do anatomy and physiology, you look at disease processes. We had lecturers coming in from all over the place teaching us. It wasn’t just lectures in herbal medicine. It was other, I suppose you would say more conventional. It was a really, really interesting course. I absolutely loved it. We had to do 500 clinical hours to get the degree. A lot of it was practice-based, and we were assessed whilst practicing.
What a lot of patients don’t always know is that herbalists are trained in all of the medical examinations that a GP would be trained in. When you do your final exam, you have to demonstrate that you’re competent in all of those areas. It’s really, realy in-depth and a bit daunting when you first start because not only do you need to have an understanding of all the conventional drugs, but you also need to have a full understanding of all the herbs.
Becky: That’s really interesting. To marry those two disciplines, it’s really complicated. I was interested that you opened your own practice in 2007 in Hythe. I was looking at your website, and I see that you specialize in fertility. Were you drawn to that for any reason?
Jodie: I’ve always worked a lot with women’s health and supported patients in pregnancy, but I’ve ended up specializing in fertility more due to my own personal experiences, due to the fact that we were trying to conceive ourselves for a number of years and actually found through all the doctor’s tests that there was no medical reason as to why we weren’t falling pregnant. I, of course, went into so much detail and studied that side of things even more so than I had done during my degree training, trying to find a way of us falling pregnant. Once we ended up being referred for IVF, the tests were a lot more in-depth, and they then found that we had an immunological reason why we weren’t falling pregnant. That was after three years of trying to conceive.
Becky: That must have been really stressful.
Jodie: It was. Yes, it was really hard because as a practitioner in the health sphere, and also knowing how well myself and my husband both were, and the fact that we just couldn’t see any medical reason why we weren’t falling pregnant, and it was a real challenge for me.
Ben: I think when there’s no movement on your fertility success, it is deeply frustrating. We were told constantly, oh, it’s unexplained, it’s unexplained. Towards the end, we were told, Becky, that your eggs were probably the reason. For you, Jodie, to go through three years of that, I do understand that’s really tough.
Jodie: I’ve actually mentioned to patients that I’ve worked with that sometimes it’s worth having further tests with a private clinic because the tests that are done on the NHS sometimes don’t uncover the reasons. I was actually quite, I suppose anger is a bit strong, but when we actually found out the reason, it all made sense. I felt like had we had those further tests sooner, we wouldn’t have been– It was a lot of stress over a number of years.
Ben: Everything is focused, isn’t it? Initially on just quality of sperm, quality of eggs, and that’s just about it. People are looking much more at alternative approaches to their fertility and owning their fertility health.
Becky: Which herbs do you think really helped to optimize your fertility, or which herbs do you recommend to your patients?
Jodie: It’s quite a complex question because of the way we work. There are herbs that are known to be helpful for fertility, but actually, because we’re coming at it from the aspect that, generally speaking, reproduction is a natural, normal process the body’s trying to do, we’re always looking to optimize the patient’s health. There are lots of aspects to what might optimize your fertility. When it comes down to saying, I’ve had patients who have gone to a [unintelligible 00:07:27] shop and they’ve taken particular herbs, but actually, it’s so much more complex than that because if, for example, you take a fertility-optimizing herb that’s working on the reproductive system, but you’re stressed up to the eyeballs, then that in itself is an issue.
Quite often, when we see patients for fertility issues, because I’m taking an hour’s case history with them, you talk about, obviously, why they’ve come, but you’re looking at all the different body systems. You get an understanding of their general health. Although someone might say, “Well, I have regular periods, and I don’t have any period problems.” Then once they come in, when you dive a little deeper, you often find, oh, actually, that area needs a bit more support, or it appears as though your, I don’t know, your luteal phase might be a bit short.
Ben: Basically, what you’re saying is it’s probably not the right approach just to head down to your local herbal shop and just buy what takes your fancy. See a herbalist like yourself first, just so you can get a more bespoke diagnosis.
Jodie: Yes, I think so. Also, there’s a time factor often with fertility. A lot of patients I see are anxious about advancing years. I would say don’t mess about with herbal medicine when there are qualified medical herbalists that you can actually consult and then have an individualized prescription made up that would be looking at all of those different things.
Becky: What you’re saying is that the patient’s lifestyle and diet presumably has a huge effect on their fertility.
Jodie: Oh, massive, yes.
Becky: The herbs have been used to support fertility. What, in your opinion, makes them so effective?
Jodie: I think because the body recognizes them so well, but we’ve evolved with plants, so they’re almost like an extension of food. Whereas with drugs, they’re man-made because, as I say, they’re natural. I think they work very quickly in the body. Over hundreds of years, we’ve relied on these plants. Really, if you look at history, it’s only in the last 100 or so years that what we call conventional medicine has really been at the forefront here. If you go to other countries like China, you find that traditional herbal medicine is used by a huge amount of people. Actually, they do access conventional medicine, but it’s normal to see a herbalist there.
Ben: For a lot of patients, they’re struggling through with the stresses of treatment, and they’re paying quite a lot of money out for tests here and there. It makes sense to me that they go and see a herbalist as well.
Jodie: It’s nowhere near as much as it would be if you went to see a consultant at a private hospital. Generally, medical herbalists charge usually around £60 or £70 for the first appointment. Although it falls within the private healthcare area, I do believe it’s accessible to people.
Ben: Should patients take the plunge right at the start of their fertility journey, say, right, I’m going to go the herbal route right now just to rule things out, or should they wait a bit?
Jodie: I think it’s helpful in some situations to have some testing and things done and scans. Actually, if a patient comes to me and they’ve already had some of that work done, then that’s giving me more information. A lot of the questions that we ask in the appointment, it gives me an understanding of what’s going on for them, even without the tests, in preparation for pregnancy. We’re always looking at getting a patient as strong as they possibly can be in terms of their reproductive health, and also just their general health and wellbeing before they fall pregnant.
Becky: It must have been very challenging as a professional helping women who are coming into your clinic, maybe couples coming into your clinic, and they were coming in with fertility issues. At the time that you were having fertility issues, how did you separate your personal and professional life?
Jodie: Generally speaking, just as with the doctor, quite often you don’t discuss your own personal story. Whilst I was going through it myself, I didn’t talk to patients. They didn’t have a clue that I was going through all of that. Sometimes I’d be off having scans and then come back for an afternoon clinic. It was probably a few years after having our first son that, every so often, I might mention that I had some understanding of what they were going through. Of course, my experience is never the same as their experience. I think until you’ve been through IVF, it’s hard to know what it feels like to have many years of trying and not falling pregnant.
Ben: I wanted to ask you a little bit about the psychology behind the patients that you see. We know that in conventional IVF medication, small little variants can sometimes make a difference. Patients might be prescribed prednisone, like a steroid, low dose, or aspirin, or things like that. If they were to take a herbal remedy as well, diagnosed by you, is it the same? It has possibly an incremental effect rather than an incredible effect?
Jodie: Yes. There’s quite different treating patients who aren’t going through IVF to those that are. What I tend to do and have done for many years is to support patients on an emotional level, giving them herbs that support the nervous system and adaptogenic herbs which support your adrenal response, so your stress response. Also, some that maintain proper bowel function and liver clearance. When somebody’s having IVF treatment, I don’t touch the hormonal side, the reproductive hormonal side at all, because I leave that to the IVF team.
Becky: I love the fact that you obviously respect conventional medicine enough. I’m just going to tap back into how amazing it must be for fertility patients coming into your clinic to encounter the empathy and understanding you naturally have because you went through IVF.
Jodie: It was three years of what they called unexplained infertility. Then once we had IVF treatment, sadly, I had hyperstimulation syndrome quite badly. That bit was quite challenging. We did end up with six embryos out of that cycle.
Ben: Did they freeze all the embryos?
Jodie: Leo was transferred at day two, and the others were frozen. That clinic was shut down, and then we had to have them moved. I actually found that really anxiety-provoking. Then after that, I was able to have non-medicated IVF, where they tracked my normal cycle and just put the embryo back at the correct time. I didn’t have any further medication which you can imagine having injecting every day. All of that was actually really stressful for me because I was a bit like, oh, I should be able to overcome this with herbs.
Becky: Do you think you put undue pressure on yourself in that respect?
Jodie: Oh, hugely, yes, because it felt like a failure somehow that being able to conceive your own child feels like this thing that you do as a female, and especially if you’re healthy and well and my diet was great and all of that.
Becky: Yes, that’s very interesting because there’s a whole discussion about shame and guilt with women who have been hugely challenged by not being able to conceive, and they feel. I did feel like a failure to a certain extent, and then I realized that I wasn’t, and I got through that. It’s definitely there.
Jodie: Oh, without a doubt. It’s very hard when you’re at that time in your life where other family members, friends, literally, it felt like every week somebody was telling me they were pregnant. It’s so, so hard. I think I’ve spoken to my family about this many times where you want to be so pleased for your family members that they’re pregnant, and yet the feeling, partly of jealousy, partly feeling cross and frustrated. Just all those emotions I found so, so hard. Leo was all medicated because it was that normal protocol.
Then I had Jake put back, and that was all fine. That was normal. It was completely natural and fell pregnant. Then I was in this sort of full sense of security thinking, well, we’ve overcome this now. If we have other transfers, it will just, poof, I’ll be pregnant. Then we had an embryo that didn’t thaw properly, disintegrated, and then we had two failed attempts, and then Willow.
Becky: I wanted to just move on from herbalism to your experience as a reflexologist. Just going into a bit more detail, could you tell me about fertility and it’s the hands and the feet?
Jodie: Yes. I don’t actually practice hand reflexology at all. I just work on the feet. There are particular areas. Basically, reflexology is based on the premise that there are particular areas on the soles of the feet, not just the soles around the ankles and on top of the feet, that correspond to different areas in the body. By stimulating those areas with particular– it’s like a particular pressure technique that we use, you’re helping to balance each area. It’s funny because reflexology has always been a tricky one for me, because coming at it from a scientific point of view, it’s almost hard for me to get my head around. I know that sounds strange, being a reflexologist, but I’ve seen so many amazing effects from it.
I think even if you were to pare it right back and look at the fact that you have a higher level of endorphins in the system, and you can measure that cortisol, stress hormone level, drops when you have reflexology, even those two things. If you were to not believe any of the other ancient stuff, you can see how that would be beneficial for those that are struggling with conceiving.
Ben: One thing I noticed is when we had our treatment, acupuncture was pretty much the only thing that you would consider. Definitely not now. We went to a fertility conference recently, and there was a reflexology association there. Clearly, fertility patients think of this as an option.
Jodie: Oh, yes, absolutely.
Ben: Who’s to say that a session with a reflexologist would not in some way help the mindset before or after treatment?
Jodie: It’s really up to the patient as to whether they want to discuss things with me in relation to me having also gone through it. Some patients really want to talk to me on a level with me having had that experience, and some don’t.
Becky: How do you gauge how sensitive a patient is?
Jodie: Sometimes when a patient books in, they might know that I’ve been through that experience. They might actually say in the appointment that they know that. Sometimes they’ve been referred by other patients who know that. Often, they’re opening up to saying, “I’m aware that you’ve had this experience.” Some people have gone as far as to say, “I’ve booked this appointment because I know you’ve been through this and because I’m aware of that.”
Becky: I think that’s amazing. I think that’s wonderful.
Jodie: It’s funny because I treat patients with gallbladder problems and headaches and all sorts of other complaints, but with this particular area, because I think IVF is such a unique thing to go through.
Ben: It comes down to mind and body, doesn’t it? A lot of these remedies are there to treat both. I think, what do we say, Becky, to an IVF patient just starting out? Give it a go. Call up a herbalist and just have a chat.
Becky: I just think it’s wonderful that, ironically, you went through a really tough time, but here you are helping people.
Jodie: It’s a real privilege, to be honest. I had a patient recently come in with their baby. I actually cried when I held the baby because I knew what they’d been through on the lead-up. I said, I’m really sorry, I just can’t help it because it’s such a massive thing to go through, isn’t it? To have this beautiful little baby at the end of it is just wonderful. If I can play any sort of part in that, it’s a real privilege. Definitely.
[music]
Becky: Thanks for listening to Becky & Ben’s Fertility Spotlight.
Ben: Head over to our Instagram page to join our fertility community.
Becky: Next time we speak to fertility consultant, Dr. Thomas [unintelligible 00:20:12]. We’ll be talking about fertility add-on treatments and what you really need to know.
Ben: For a personalized diagnosis, always speak to a healthcare professional.
Becky: Don’t despair.
Ben: We’ll get there.
[music]
[00:20:30] [END OF AUDIO]
Is Herbal Medicine Safe During IVF?
Herbal medicine might help certain fertility patients. Might. But it’s not automatically safe. Nor are herbs a substitute for proper, evidence-based treatment. For some patients, herbs may help with issues linked to fertility: stress, sleep, menstrual symptoms, metabolic health and sperm quality.
But the evidence is rather uneven. Herb quality and efficacy also vary. Some products may even interfere with fertility medication or negatively affect implantation and early pregnancy. Our advice? IVF patients need to be careful.
The safest answer is this: herbal medicine may benefit some fertility patients, but only when it’s personalised, disclosed to the fertility clinic, and timed carefully around treatment. Some patients may be advised not to take herbs at all.
What herbal medicine can and cannot do
Fertility patients are often drawn to herbal medicine as a simple solution. Holistic approaches are, after all, safe – aren’t they? Compared to the complexities of the infertility journey and the strong medication used, plant-based products are appealing. But caution is needed.
Herbal medicine practitioners tend to avoid a one-herb fix. A more joined-up, holistic assessment of the “whole person” is preferred. They may look at menstrual history, stress load, bowel habits, energy levels, sleep, metabolic health, and symptoms such as PMS, painful periods, or irregular cycles. They then build an individual plan from there.
That approach makes some sense, clinically. Fertility is affected by more than just the ovaries or testes – we all know that. Constipation can affect oestrogen clearance. Chronic stress can affect sleep, appetite, insulin resistance, and sexual function. A poor diet can disrupt ovulation and sperm DNA integrity. Herbs aren’t the magic answer, but they can play their part in a broader plan.
What herbs can’t do is guarantee conception, fix age-related egg quality, transform outcomes, or completely replace IVF treatment when IVF is clearly needed.
Where the evidence looks most promising
Glimmers of hope exist. In male fertility, the research is more encouraging. A 2024 meta-analysis, covering 23 previous studies, found that herbal medicines may improve semen volume, concentration, total sperm count, motility, and morphology. The research concluded that herbal treatments may be useful as complementary approaches for male infertility – but not a standalone solution.
In female fertility, the evidence is more mixed. Some reviews of Chinese herbal medicine used alongside IVF suggest possible improvements in embryo quality, clinical pregnancy rates, live-birth rates, endometrial receptivity and lower rates of OHSS, But the quality of evidence was modest.
For PCOS patients undergoing IVF, one 2024 study found that a Chinese herbal formula taken for 12 weeks before IVF led to better fertilisation, embryos, clinical-pregnancy and live-birth rates. That’s intriguing, but again, it’s based on limited evidence. So it’s not a definitive solution for all IVF patients. Promising isn’t the same as proven.
Herbs that may help fertility patients
These are some of the better-known herbs that fertility patients may hear about. First, for women:
Ashwagandha (withania somnifera)
This may help patients where stress, exhaustion and/or poor sleep are impacting their wellbeing. Chronic stress can affect the way women cope with the physical and mental challenges of fertility treatment. The problem, as always, is safety and effectiveness. It’s not a herb to start casually during IVF or early pregnancy without clinical oversight.
Chaste tree berry/vitex (vitex agnus-castus)
Often used for ovulation support and luteal phase progesterone support. It’s an option for irregular cycles and some PCOS patterns. But Vitex can influence hormones, which is why IVF patients should avoid self-prescribing. Fertility treatment is all about balancing hormones and the reproductive system. Herbs could interfere.
Dang gui/dong quai (angelica sinensis)
Traditionally used for menstrual health and general circulation. It may also help with endometrial function and support. But it’s also a herb that raises a practical safety flag because of the way it may alter the body’s haematological and hormonal balancing. Speak to your fertility clinic before starting it.
For male fertility patients, these herbs may be worth considering:
Panax ginseng (Asian ginseng)
May help with fatigue, libido, erectile function, and testosterone support. Some evidence suggests it could improve sperm quality in certain men, but product choice, quality and dosing matter.
Tribulus terrestris
Marketed heavily for testosterone and male fertility. Some studies suggest possible benefits for sperm parameters, but the evidence isn’t concusive enough to justify casual use without medical supervision.
Ashwagandha
Also commonly prescribed for men, especially where stress, sleep, and sperm quality are of concern. It goes back to the key message:: male fertility is one area where herbal support may be of benefit, particularly when oxidative stress is the issue.
Other herbs patients may ask about
A few other herbal remedies come up quite regularly:
Maca is often promoted for libido and reproductive wellbeing, but the evidence for fertility outcomes is still limited.
Coenzyme Q10, omega-3s, and antioxidants are not herbs, but patients often group them together with herbal support. These supplements generally have a clearer fertility rationale than many herbal blends, especially in male factor infertility – though usage during fertility treatment still needs to be reviewed by the clinic.
Can herbal medicine help unexplained infertility?
Possibly. But if a patient has unexplained infertility, it doesn’t mean there’s no cause. It means standard testing hasn’t identified one. In that conext, an individualised plan that improves sleep, stress resilience, nutrition, metabolic health, bowel regularity, inflammation and sexual wellbeing may be useful.
But unexplained infertility is also where patients can lose years chasing low-evidence options. If age, ovarian reserve, sperm issues or time trying to conceive turn up the heat, herbal medicine should be framed as adjunctive support, not as a reason to delay treatment. Clinically proven medicine takes priority.
The big safety question: should fertility or IVF patients take herbs during treatment?
This is our key point: don’t take herbal medication without asking your clinic first. During fertility treatment, herbs can create problems in several ways:
This is why many clinics prefer patients to stop non-essential herbs before ovarian stimulation, egg collection, embryo transfer, and the two-week wait – unless a clinician has reviewed and approved their use. That doesn’t mean every herb is dangerous. But caution is best.
A sensible way to think about herbs during fertility treatment
Herbal medicine is potentially most beneficial when it is used:
The bottom line
Herbal medicine may help some fertility patients – especially as part of a broader plan addressing stress, sleep, metabolic health, menstrual symptoms, and sperm quality. There’s some encouraging evidence in male fertility, and some IVF-related research is promising, particularly in selected groups such as PCOS patients. But the evidence is still patchy, and safety matters as much as efficacy.
For fertility patients, the safest message is this: don’t self-prescribe herbal medicine during treatment. If herbs are going to be part of your plan, they should be chosen for your specific situation, reviewed by your fertility clinic, and stopped or adjusted when necessary.
Frequently Asked Questions – Herbs & Fertility Treatment
Can herbal medicine improve fertility naturally?
Sometimes. Herbal medicine may support factors linked to fertility, such as stress, sleep, menstrual symptoms, metabolic health, and sperm quality. But it doesn’t fix every cause of infertility, and it shouldn’t replace fertility testing or recommended treatment.
Is herbal medicine safe during IVF?
Not automatically. Some herbs may affect hormones, blood clotting, anaesthesia, or early pregnancy, and some may interact with IVF medication. Patients should tell their clinic about every herb and supplement they take before stimulation, egg collection or embryo transfer.
Should I stop herbal remedies before embryo transfer?
In many cases, yes. Clinics often prefer patients to stop non-essential herbs before embryo transfer and during the two-week wait unless they have been specifically reviewed and approved. This reduces uncertainty around implantation, medication interactions, and early pregnancy safety.
Can herbs help unexplained infertility?
They may help indirectly by supporting overall health, menstrual cycle regulation, sleep, stress response, digestion, and inflammation. But unexplained infertility still needs proper medical assessment. Herbs should be seen as supportive, not as a reason to delay treatment when time matters.
Which herbs are commonly used for female fertility?
Common examples include ashwagandha, Vitex, and dang gui, though they’re used for different reasons. Some practitioners also use formula-based approaches rather than single herbs. The right choice depends on the patient.
Which herbs are commonly used for male fertility?
Commonly used herbs include ashwagandha, Panax ginseng and Tribulus terrestris. Research into herbs and male fertility is more encouraging than for women, especially for sperm parameters, but products should still be reviewed carefully for safety and quality.
Are herbal fertility supplements evidence-based?
Some are backed by early or moderate-quality evidence, but many are oversold. The best data tend to be on selected male fertility outcomes and some formula-based approaches used alongside IVF. Evidence is far less robust for many commercial “fertility booster” supplements.
Can I take herbs if I am trying to conceive this month?
Only with caution. If pregnancy could happen this cycle, any herb needs to be considered for any adverse or unsafe effects to your fertility and pregnancy. That includes “natural” products bought online or recommended by friends, forums or influencers.
To hear our podcast interview with Jodie Foreman, a qualified herbalist with a strong interest in fertility and IVF, listen to our podcast episode below.
[music]
Becky: A warm welcome to Becky & Ben’s Fertility Spotlight.
Ben: This podcast is about our support and your success. We focus on the key topics and the best mindset.
Becky: Today, we’re talking to medical herbalist and reflexologist Jodie Foreman about optimizing our fertility.
Ben: As always, speak to a qualified doctor for the best advice.
Becky: Let’s hear from Jodie and the healing power of hands and herbs.
[music]
Today, we are delighted to have Jodie Foreman in the studio with us. She’s a herbalist and reflexologist with her own practice. We are very interested in talking to Jodie about how herbs and reflexology can optimize fertility.
Ben: I remember, Becky, you didn’t take any herbs, but you did have reflexology. You were very chilled out after it. I remember that.
Becky: Yes, I was. A lovely girl called Chloe, when we lived up north, she was very sweet. She was very young. She was only about 18, I think. I knew her mom. She came to practice on me, on my feet, when I was going through a lot of difficulties. She was very sensitive. She located areas that might be connected to fertility. I remember afterwards, feeling extremely relaxed and lighter, in a sense.
Ben: I remember you were really, really relaxed afterwards, so much so that I said to Chloe, “Can I have a go?” I think it’s just the intimacy of someone else being in the room, knowing their craft, and just getting you to chill out.
Becky: I do know that it can be incredibly effective. What inspired you to become a reflexologist and then a herbalist?
Jodie Foreman: When I was 17, I was poorly. I was doing my A-levels. I kept having these weird, almost like fainting attacks, which I then, later on, found out was a form of epilepsy. I went up to London, had loads of scans and tests and things, saw a neurologist. They put me on lots of medication, which I really struggled to take. In the end, I had been diagnosed with epilepsy, but I came off the medication, went on herbal medicine, had reflexology, found it enormously helpful, and continued on with that for some time. Never did have a full-blown seizure. Never had any problems since. That diagnosis has been taken off my medical notes. I felt like, oh, there’s something in this. This is amazing. I’d always really been interested in people, working with people, thought I would probably go into some sort of caring profession.
Ben: You studied herbal medicine at the University of Westminster. Clearly, it had made an impression on you from an early age. Was that an enjoyable course?
Jodie: It was fantastic. It was the Bachelor of Science, so it was a lot more– I guess it was a lot more sciencey in a way. That sounds a strange thing to say. I thought it was going to be because you study biochemistry, you do anatomy and physiology, you look at disease processes. We had lecturers coming in from all over the place teaching us. It wasn’t just lectures in herbal medicine. It was other, I suppose you would say more conventional. It was a really, really interesting course. I absolutely loved it. We had to do 500 clinical hours to get the degree. A lot of it was practice-based, and we were assessed whilst practicing.
What a lot of patients don’t always know is that herbalists are trained in all of the medical examinations that a GP would be trained in. When you do your final exam, you have to demonstrate that you’re competent in all of those areas. It’s really, realy in-depth and a bit daunting when you first start because not only do you need to have an understanding of all the conventional drugs, but you also need to have a full understanding of all the herbs.
Becky: That’s really interesting. To marry those two disciplines, it’s really complicated. I was interested that you opened your own practice in 2007 in Hythe. I was looking at your website, and I see that you specialize in fertility. Were you drawn to that for any reason?
Jodie: I’ve always worked a lot with women’s health and supported patients in pregnancy, but I’ve ended up specializing in fertility more due to my own personal experiences, due to the fact that we were trying to conceive ourselves for a number of years and actually found through all the doctor’s tests that there was no medical reason as to why we weren’t falling pregnant. I, of course, went into so much detail and studied that side of things even more so than I had done during my degree training, trying to find a way of us falling pregnant. Once we ended up being referred for IVF, the tests were a lot more in-depth, and they then found that we had an immunological reason why we weren’t falling pregnant. That was after three years of trying to conceive.
Becky: That must have been really stressful.
Jodie: It was. Yes, it was really hard because as a practitioner in the health sphere, and also knowing how well myself and my husband both were, and the fact that we just couldn’t see any medical reason why we weren’t falling pregnant, and it was a real challenge for me.
Ben: I think when there’s no movement on your fertility success, it is deeply frustrating. We were told constantly, oh, it’s unexplained, it’s unexplained. Towards the end, we were told, Becky, that your eggs were probably the reason. For you, Jodie, to go through three years of that, I do understand that’s really tough.
Jodie: I’ve actually mentioned to patients that I’ve worked with that sometimes it’s worth having further tests with a private clinic because the tests that are done on the NHS sometimes don’t uncover the reasons. I was actually quite, I suppose anger is a bit strong, but when we actually found out the reason, it all made sense. I felt like had we had those further tests sooner, we wouldn’t have been– It was a lot of stress over a number of years.
Ben: Everything is focused, isn’t it? Initially on just quality of sperm, quality of eggs, and that’s just about it. People are looking much more at alternative approaches to their fertility and owning their fertility health.
Becky: Which herbs do you think really helped to optimize your fertility, or which herbs do you recommend to your patients?
Jodie: It’s quite a complex question because of the way we work. There are herbs that are known to be helpful for fertility, but actually, because we’re coming at it from the aspect that, generally speaking, reproduction is a natural, normal process the body’s trying to do, we’re always looking to optimize the patient’s health. There are lots of aspects to what might optimize your fertility. When it comes down to saying, I’ve had patients who have gone to a [unintelligible 00:07:27] shop and they’ve taken particular herbs, but actually, it’s so much more complex than that because if, for example, you take a fertility-optimizing herb that’s working on the reproductive system, but you’re stressed up to the eyeballs, then that in itself is an issue.
Quite often, when we see patients for fertility issues, because I’m taking an hour’s case history with them, you talk about, obviously, why they’ve come, but you’re looking at all the different body systems. You get an understanding of their general health. Although someone might say, “Well, I have regular periods, and I don’t have any period problems.” Then once they come in, when you dive a little deeper, you often find, oh, actually, that area needs a bit more support, or it appears as though your, I don’t know, your luteal phase might be a bit short.
Ben: Basically, what you’re saying is it’s probably not the right approach just to head down to your local herbal shop and just buy what takes your fancy. See a herbalist like yourself first, just so you can get a more bespoke diagnosis.
Jodie: Yes, I think so. Also, there’s a time factor often with fertility. A lot of patients I see are anxious about advancing years. I would say don’t mess about with herbal medicine when there are qualified medical herbalists that you can actually consult and then have an individualized prescription made up that would be looking at all of those different things.
Becky: What you’re saying is that the patient’s lifestyle and diet presumably has a huge effect on their fertility.
Jodie: Oh, massive, yes.
Becky: The herbs have been used to support fertility. What, in your opinion, makes them so effective?
Jodie: I think because the body recognizes them so well, but we’ve evolved with plants, so they’re almost like an extension of food. Whereas with drugs, they’re man-made because, as I say, they’re natural. I think they work very quickly in the body. Over hundreds of years, we’ve relied on these plants. Really, if you look at history, it’s only in the last 100 or so years that what we call conventional medicine has really been at the forefront here. If you go to other countries like China, you find that traditional herbal medicine is used by a huge amount of people. Actually, they do access conventional medicine, but it’s normal to see a herbalist there.
Ben: For a lot of patients, they’re struggling through with the stresses of treatment, and they’re paying quite a lot of money out for tests here and there. It makes sense to me that they go and see a herbalist as well.
Jodie: It’s nowhere near as much as it would be if you went to see a consultant at a private hospital. Generally, medical herbalists charge usually around £60 or £70 for the first appointment. Although it falls within the private healthcare area, I do believe it’s accessible to people.
Ben: Should patients take the plunge right at the start of their fertility journey, say, right, I’m going to go the herbal route right now just to rule things out, or should they wait a bit?
Jodie: I think it’s helpful in some situations to have some testing and things done and scans. Actually, if a patient comes to me and they’ve already had some of that work done, then that’s giving me more information. A lot of the questions that we ask in the appointment, it gives me an understanding of what’s going on for them, even without the tests, in preparation for pregnancy. We’re always looking at getting a patient as strong as they possibly can be in terms of their reproductive health, and also just their general health and wellbeing before they fall pregnant.
Becky: It must have been very challenging as a professional helping women who are coming into your clinic, maybe couples coming into your clinic, and they were coming in with fertility issues. At the time that you were having fertility issues, how did you separate your personal and professional life?
Jodie: Generally speaking, just as with the doctor, quite often you don’t discuss your own personal story. Whilst I was going through it myself, I didn’t talk to patients. They didn’t have a clue that I was going through all of that. Sometimes I’d be off having scans and then come back for an afternoon clinic. It was probably a few years after having our first son that, every so often, I might mention that I had some understanding of what they were going through. Of course, my experience is never the same as their experience. I think until you’ve been through IVF, it’s hard to know what it feels like to have many years of trying and not falling pregnant.
Ben: I wanted to ask you a little bit about the psychology behind the patients that you see. We know that in conventional IVF medication, small little variants can sometimes make a difference. Patients might be prescribed prednisone, like a steroid, low dose, or aspirin, or things like that. If they were to take a herbal remedy as well, diagnosed by you, is it the same? It has possibly an incremental effect rather than an incredible effect?
Jodie: Yes. There’s quite different treating patients who aren’t going through IVF to those that are. What I tend to do and have done for many years is to support patients on an emotional level, giving them herbs that support the nervous system and adaptogenic herbs which support your adrenal response, so your stress response. Also, some that maintain proper bowel function and liver clearance. When somebody’s having IVF treatment, I don’t touch the hormonal side, the reproductive hormonal side at all, because I leave that to the IVF team.
Becky: I love the fact that you obviously respect conventional medicine enough. I’m just going to tap back into how amazing it must be for fertility patients coming into your clinic to encounter the empathy and understanding you naturally have because you went through IVF.
Jodie: It was three years of what they called unexplained infertility. Then once we had IVF treatment, sadly, I had hyperstimulation syndrome quite badly. That bit was quite challenging. We did end up with six embryos out of that cycle.
Ben: Did they freeze all the embryos?
Jodie: Leo was transferred at day two, and the others were frozen. That clinic was shut down, and then we had to have them moved. I actually found that really anxiety-provoking. Then after that, I was able to have non-medicated IVF, where they tracked my normal cycle and just put the embryo back at the correct time. I didn’t have any further medication which you can imagine having injecting every day. All of that was actually really stressful for me because I was a bit like, oh, I should be able to overcome this with herbs.
Becky: Do you think you put undue pressure on yourself in that respect?
Jodie: Oh, hugely, yes, because it felt like a failure somehow that being able to conceive your own child feels like this thing that you do as a female, and especially if you’re healthy and well and my diet was great and all of that.
Becky: Yes, that’s very interesting because there’s a whole discussion about shame and guilt with women who have been hugely challenged by not being able to conceive, and they feel. I did feel like a failure to a certain extent, and then I realized that I wasn’t, and I got through that. It’s definitely there.
Jodie: Oh, without a doubt. It’s very hard when you’re at that time in your life where other family members, friends, literally, it felt like every week somebody was telling me they were pregnant. It’s so, so hard. I think I’ve spoken to my family about this many times where you want to be so pleased for your family members that they’re pregnant, and yet the feeling, partly of jealousy, partly feeling cross and frustrated. Just all those emotions I found so, so hard. Leo was all medicated because it was that normal protocol.
Then I had Jake put back, and that was all fine. That was normal. It was completely natural and fell pregnant. Then I was in this sort of full sense of security thinking, well, we’ve overcome this now. If we have other transfers, it will just, poof, I’ll be pregnant. Then we had an embryo that didn’t thaw properly, disintegrated, and then we had two failed attempts, and then Willow.
Becky: I wanted to just move on from herbalism to your experience as a reflexologist. Just going into a bit more detail, could you tell me about fertility and it’s the hands and the feet?
Jodie: Yes. I don’t actually practice hand reflexology at all. I just work on the feet. There are particular areas. Basically, reflexology is based on the premise that there are particular areas on the soles of the feet, not just the soles around the ankles and on top of the feet, that correspond to different areas in the body. By stimulating those areas with particular– it’s like a particular pressure technique that we use, you’re helping to balance each area. It’s funny because reflexology has always been a tricky one for me, because coming at it from a scientific point of view, it’s almost hard for me to get my head around. I know that sounds strange, being a reflexologist, but I’ve seen so many amazing effects from it.
I think even if you were to pare it right back and look at the fact that you have a higher level of endorphins in the system, and you can measure that cortisol, stress hormone level, drops when you have reflexology, even those two things. If you were to not believe any of the other ancient stuff, you can see how that would be beneficial for those that are struggling with conceiving.
Ben: One thing I noticed is when we had our treatment, acupuncture was pretty much the only thing that you would consider. Definitely not now. We went to a fertility conference recently, and there was a reflexology association there. Clearly, fertility patients think of this as an option.
Jodie: Oh, yes, absolutely.
Ben: Who’s to say that a session with a reflexologist would not in some way help the mindset before or after treatment?
Jodie: It’s really up to the patient as to whether they want to discuss things with me in relation to me having also gone through it. Some patients really want to talk to me on a level with me having had that experience, and some don’t.
Becky: How do you gauge how sensitive a patient is?
Jodie: Sometimes when a patient books in, they might know that I’ve been through that experience. They might actually say in the appointment that they know that. Sometimes they’ve been referred by other patients who know that. Often, they’re opening up to saying, “I’m aware that you’ve had this experience.” Some people have gone as far as to say, “I’ve booked this appointment because I know you’ve been through this and because I’m aware of that.”
Becky: I think that’s amazing. I think that’s wonderful.
Jodie: It’s funny because I treat patients with gallbladder problems and headaches and all sorts of other complaints, but with this particular area, because I think IVF is such a unique thing to go through.
Ben: It comes down to mind and body, doesn’t it? A lot of these remedies are there to treat both. I think, what do we say, Becky, to an IVF patient just starting out? Give it a go. Call up a herbalist and just have a chat.
Becky: I just think it’s wonderful that, ironically, you went through a really tough time, but here you are helping people.
Jodie: It’s a real privilege, to be honest. I had a patient recently come in with their baby. I actually cried when I held the baby because I knew what they’d been through on the lead-up. I said, I’m really sorry, I just can’t help it because it’s such a massive thing to go through, isn’t it? To have this beautiful little baby at the end of it is just wonderful. If I can play any sort of part in that, it’s a real privilege. Definitely.
[music]
Becky: Thanks for listening to Becky & Ben’s Fertility Spotlight.
Ben: Head over to our Instagram page to join our fertility community.
Becky: Next time we speak to fertility consultant, Dr. Thomas [unintelligible 00:20:12]. We’ll be talking about fertility add-on treatments and what you really need to know.
Ben: For a personalized diagnosis, always speak to a healthcare professional.
Becky: Don’t despair.
Ben: We’ll get there.
[music]
[00:20:30] [END OF AUDIO]
Our Services
Our uNique support
Superb czech clinic
Stress-free Experience
Top pages
For more information on how we can help you, book your free consultation
Related posts
Nutrition During IVF: 9 Crucial Tips
Good nutrition during IVF treatment matters more than patients think. There are no ‘magic’ foods – but read our helpful tips to optimise your fertility diet.
Can Music Support Fertility Patients?
Music could help with the stresses of fertility treatment. Our guest blogger, Dr. Alison Short, explains the supportive power of music and music therapy.
Stress, Anxiety and IVF: What Really Affects Your Chances?
Can stress really reduce the chance of a successful IVF cycle? We look at the realities of stress and anxiety during fertility treatment. You may be surprised.